Neuroscientist James Cooke hosts a podcast series, Living Mirrors. This episode contains a wide-ranging conversation that begins with a comparison of the essential features of the different traditions Rupert grew up with and which inform his teaching. He outlines the ‘inward-facing’, or ‘exclusive’ path of Classical Advaita Vedanta, the ‘inclusive’ tantric approach of Kashmiri Shaivism, and the similarities and differences between the two.
In response to the question ‘why would anyone do self-enquiry?’, Rupert explains his central message that while everyone loves happiness above all else, most people seek it through objects, substances, relationships and states of mind, none of which can ever provide the lasting peace for which we all long. When this fact is realised, the spiritual path begins.
In an exploration of the subject–object collapse, Rupert states that it is not the illusion of separation that disappears, but the ignorance attached to it; we still seem to see many objects, but we recognize that they’re all appearances within and made of a single reality, rather than individual ones. And that includes the appearance that we call ‘our self’.
How the path unfolds can be experienced and described at different stages as gradual (or indirect) focusing on objects, such as mantras; or as direct, going directly to our true nature of awareness. To start with, meditation is seen as something we do in order to see or understand ourselves; in time, we realise meditation is in fact what we are.
Towards the end, Dr Cooke brings up what is referred to as the ‘consciousness-only’ model for the nature of reality, and how he diverges from that view. He and Rupert agree to disagree on terminology but are in accord that language, tied as it is to objective experience, cannot ever describe that which is beyond conceptual thought.
Finally, he asks Rupert about his previous career as an artist, which brings the conversation to a close with a confirmation of the experience of beauty, love and truth as indivisible reality, and of the necessity to live a life consistent with the implications of that understanding.
You can listen to this episode on the Rupert Spira Podcast
https://rupertspira.libsyn.com/episode-19-dr-james-cooke
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